Subject: [Fwd: Re: crash site help needed]

I got this request for help from Rick Miller AA17700@aol.com. I contacted Bob Clewell, Cdr, A/101 Avn Bn-- his answer in next e-mail will add facts.

We have a C Trp sister who was given a single tooth of WO1 Crandall as proof of death. (He was listed as MIA in Laos, he was seen to go straight in, explode and burn, positive no survivors) I think it was 1989, she said on the MIA/POW net, "I regret that a single tooth was buried in Arlington National Cemetery, but I don't believe that a tooth proves death, just that he lost a tooth in the crash.

B Troop had the task of covering the entire Squadron AO in Vietnam while A & C went to Laos, so I thought maybe your guys might have some input on this matter. I know that Concannon and Burke were killed in crash just two days earlier on a rope extraction.

OUT FRONT,
Mac

From: AA17700@aol.com
Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999 18:06:23
Subject: Re: crash site help needed

My brother was a crew chief on a UH-1H helicopter with the 101st airborne in Vietnam. On Feb 17,1971 he was on an extraction mission on the West Wall of the Ashua Valley up from the old special forces camp. The helicopter was shot and all on board were KIA, a SF bright light team was sent in to locate the site, they did locate the site but had to leave due to heavy enemy fire, the remains were left at the site and were never recovered.

The JTFFA has teams of US and Vietnamese military that are currently searching for that crash site, so far they have been unable to locate it. The JTFFA is looking for anyone that may have witnesses this crash in 71, to help locate it. I have a document that states the call sign Griffin on it, which I believe indicates that gunships from your group were involved with this mission.Would you be willing to check with your people to see if anyone remembers this crash and would have any details. I have a tremendous amount of data on this crash (maps,photo,etc) if it would help jog someones memory. More info about this crash is located at my web site: HTTP://www.vietvet.org/demsey.htm. Any assistance you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Dave Demsey

From: MAC skywalker06@sprintmail.com
Date: Monday, June 28, 1999 8:26 PM
Subject: Griffins

Got a research request forwarded to me just now, a UH-IH shot down Feb 17, 1971 in the A Shau, all lost. SF team went in but couldn't recover any bodies due to intense fire.

I have read about that incident I believe, but the data base is temp closed.

Weren't the Griffins the gun company for the 101 Bn, ie D Company.

Mac

From: "Robert Clewell" rclewell@valunet.com
Date: Mon, 28 Jun 1999
Subject: Griffins

The Griffins were C battery 4/77th ARA. The 101 battalion guns in D company 70/71 were "hawks", 158th were the Redskins whose card read, "killin' is our business and business is good." They are trying to find someone familiar enough with the terrain and a CCN mission on 18 Feb '71 to be able to pinpoint the crash site of a comanchero UH1H that went down with all aboard and 2 SF'ers on strings that day on the west wall of the Ashau. The following day, a third SOG member became the only survivor when he was extracted from a location some distance away. Apparently his string was cut or broke. The BL team reached the crash site ok but had to be extracted without the bodies of the other six men.

Good wishes and All the Best

Excerpt from E-Mail received from: Fernando De Pierris at fernando_de_pierris@fmso.navy.mil

FOUND: John Hayes, author of the "Lamar Plain" story. John still lives in McKinney, Texas, where he is a member of the famous Lone Star Division, the 49th Armored Division. Fernando De Pierris talked to him on 7 March and invited him to join the group going to Vietnam. Unfortunately, his active duty commitment will not allow him to do so.

John did not know that Sp4 Joseph La Pointe had been awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor for actions on 2 June 1969. He knew it had been a bad situation, a situation he was very familiar with since he was a young Warrant Officer scout pilot flying for the 1st Brigade, our parent unit at Tam Ky, and a proponent that the NVA could not have gone anywhere else. He knew some of our scouts, and mentioned John Bailey by name. He flew for the S-2.

John was one of the scouts hovering and providing protective fire over some grunts under attack. The hovering scouts saved the day for them and he wonders who those grunts were. If some one remembers, or was one of them, please let him know via email at: lilgrif219@aol.com.

IN MEMORY

Joseph G LaPointe Jr.
Awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor

From: RandyTheDJ on 06/24/98 08:07 PM

Subject: Doc LaPointe

Hi Fernando,

I was with the 333rd TC Detachment at Eagle. I was reading the itinerary for the Vietnam trip and may be interested in joining the tour. With the 30th reunion being next year as well, I'm not sure if I can do both. But would like to at least be put on a preliminary list.

One thing that grabbed my attention immediately as I read through the information was the note about Doc. I know many of the medics were called Doc. There was only one that I knew fairly well. I've read other references to this particular guy and I need to know if its the same one I knew. He was planning on meeting his wife in Hawaii for R&R. He got delayed one day because his replacement hadn't arrived. That day, out on patrol, he was killed. If I recall, his wife was pregnant at that time.

If this is the same guy, he played guitar and sang. I had a guitar over there and played too. We spent many hours together paying and exchanging songs. His favorite song was the Beattles "Blackbird". I need to know if this is the same guy whose wife and son will be there.

Please let me know.

From: Lapointe; Cindy 06/25/98 09:21 AM

Randy

Randy! I'm thankful that you responded to Fernando. Yes, I am Doc LaPointe's widow, and he was a singer/songwriter/poet. I had already had our baby, (January 20, 1969), when we were supposed to meet in Hawaii for R&R. I realize that many believed I was en route, but I did not have my orders to go, and the airline refused to sell me a ticket. Please tell us everything you can remember... and I am interested in knowing what you are doing now. Joe III and I plan to go on the Vietnam trip next year, God willing. My sister, Kandy and some others also.

Please keep in touch, and share your memories if you can.

Most sincerely,

EDS/Ohio Solution Centers
Cindy LaPointe/Training Coordinator

I came across the picture and the note with your response, (on the Web). I had written this poem a few years ago, and have kept it away from most people.

We went to basic and medical training and flew to Vietnam and went to Sert training in Da Nang, where we received our assignments. I went to the 3/187th and he went to the 2/17th.

Frank B Smith

From the Ban'Shee Gazette:

Many of us at the Reunion discussed "Doc" and I thought it would be appropriate to include memories of him with all Ban'shees.

As I remember "Doc" was ready to go on R&R the next day. His wife was waiting for him in Hawaii.

Doc’s replacement had arrived at the unit. When we got the order to get ready to go "Doc" said, he would go instead of his replacement.

We started our helicopters, the infantry boarded, we flew an insertion into the LZ, and the rest is described in the citation for Doc’s Medal of Honor.

I personally will never forget Doc. I know many of you knew him better than I. Bringing up memories of the past is one way we hope to help our members. These are not always pleasant but, we must start the healing process. We believe that process was started at LZ Ratliff this year.

We would like to hear everyone's account of Docs passing. This would enable us to put together a better history for the Association, of what the circumstances were that day.
Jim Matthews

Dave Martin's sister had cooresponded with Ron(?) while we were in Vietnam and would like to make contact with him again. Can you help identify him. Any information can be sent to Dave Martin at tdc705@email.msn.com. Click photo for close up.

Folks, I found this picture, taken by our eminent in-country resident photographer Mr. Randy Kunkleman (in a box with hundres of slides), Lord of the Rock Crasher, and a couple of names scape me.... can you help identify this charming group of scouts and gunnys who obviously had nothing else to do while we slick drivers were busy fighting the war!.

Fernando

Fernando,

? on right looks like Kent Hitchings to me. You should be able to ask him at the reunion. He should be there, he was in the advanced party to set it up.

Randy

At our 1998 Reunion at Ft Campbell, we identified the last missing name which was Bruce Osborne, remember him?

From fernando_de_pierris@fmso.navy.mil Mon Aug 17 04:38:17 1998
To: dschave@hotmail.com
Subject: mistery picture

Dan, in the mistery picture, we thought we had everyone identified, left to right: Bill Russell, Bruce OSborne, Carl Cvitcovich, Kent Hitchings, Ed Ashtron, and Ed Barnes.....

Please clarify that Bill Rusell is incorrect. Below is a picture of the real Bill Russell, a handsome yound devil as you can see. Sorry for the confusion Bill.

Thanks, Fernando

Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 09:54:55 EDT
From: Droog101@aol.com
To: scjones@uslink.net

Dear Mr. Jones,

Your web-page is an inspiration. Although I am too young to remember much about the Viet-Nam war, pages like yours make it a much clearer reality for people in my generation. And, since you were successful in your search for Felix, I was inspired to ask for your assistance in my search for people who knew my father.

My name is Greg and my father was George U. Stapp, Jr. He was stationed at Camp Eagle in 1968-69 as an Air Ambulatory Med-Evac pilot flying UH1-B's and OH-6A's. Although he survived two tours in Viet-Nam (the second was in 1971, the same year I was born), he died in 1979 when I was eight. Since I was unable to get to know him very well before he died, I am searching for people who knew him (outside of my family). If you knew him, or could point me in the direction of people who might have known him, I would greatly appreciate your response.

My e-mail address is droog101@aol.com.

Thanks very much,
Greg

Steve Jones, scjones@uslink.net wrote:

Hi Greg!

Thank you for sending your request for information on your father. I saw it right after you sent it. Since that time I have put a few things together asking for help. You should get some response in the next few days I think. Let me tell you what I've done.

First, I've contacted Julie Kink, who is instrumental in finding family and friends of past Vietnam Vets. Her brother was killed in Vietnam in 1969 while piloting OH-6s. She just got back from the Vietnam Helicopter Pilot Association annual convention in Texas over the July 4th weekend. She's very good at helping others and has resources to help.

Second, I've sent an email to Felix and he will post to both our Veteran Nets, which look Forward to requests like yours. Together these chat nets have over 500 Vietnam pilots and crew members and their contacts are vast.

Hi Greg,

I am Julie Kink, whom Steve Jones mentioned. I am a member of the Family Contacts Committee of the Vietnam Helicopter Flight Crew Network, which helps connect family like you with folks who knew their loved one. Grant Isom, also on the committee, will be helping you with resources and I don't want to overlap what he is doing, but just wanted to write you a note of encouragement since Steve mentioned my name. I am a little sister of a helicopter pilot who was killed in Vietnam.

If you haven't already, you might want to check out the Vietnam Veterans Memorial Fund's (VVMF) "In Touch" program. You can read about In Touch at http://www.vvmf.org/vvmf/programs/in-touch/in-touch-ovw.htm. You can email to request a form to fill out, with which you can register that you would like to be contacted by anybody who knew your dad.

There are also some other good resources on the internet. Sons and Daughters In Touch (see http://members.aol.com/sditnatl/index.html) is a great group. Jeanette Chervony at FrstAlto@AOL.com is web mistress. Her dad was killed in Vietnam - she knows me and you can tell her I sent you her email address if you are interested in getting more info.

There are also bulletin boards on the internet such as "Lost and Found" where you might want to post a listing - page is at http://www.vietvet.org/armylf.htm.

Another bulletin board is at http://www.shipmates.com/locator/locator.htm.

To explain a bit, my brother, David Kink, died on August 3, 1969 as a result of injuries received in a light observation helicopter (LOH) crash on July 21. I had just turned eight years old at the time of his death, the same age as you when your dad died. For years I wanted to know more about what kind of a person he was.

I stumbled upon the VHPA via the internet in 1996. Let me tell you, the first time one of them emailed me offering to help me find friends of my brother's from flight school, it brought tears to my eyes when I read "Your brother was our brother." This is how they feel about your dad, too.

I owe a great deal to the Vietnam Veterans who have become my new "big brothers." Because of these contacts, I met three buddies of my brother's in flight school, talked to the man who helped put my brother on the medevac, met David's troop commander and the Cobra pilot who called in the Mayday.

From the few people I have talked to who actually served with Dave, I have learned that he would have probably made a good pilot had he lived, that he was accepted by "the gang" in Vietnam, that he was apprehensive about transitioning into LOH's from Hueys, that he matured over there and seemed to be developing the ability to handle things under pressure. All these things would never have been possible for me to know if not for the friendship of my new big brothers.

I tell you all this so you know you aren't alone in what you are doing. There are lots of us out here to help, and I feel certain you'll find people who can tell you about your dad's service. I hope you don't mind me writing to you out of the blue but I wanted to offer a little encouragement. I know how hard it can be. Take care and good luck in your search.

Good luck!

Julie Kink - Stillwater, Minnesota
sister of WO1 David R. Kink
C troop 1/9 CAV 1 CAV June to July 1969

P.S. My story is posted on the VVMF's "Remember Them" page. In case you want to read it, it's at http://www.vvmf.org/vvmf/programs/rem-them/kink.htm.

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